They had been enroute to Falealili to deliver a cement load (uka simā) for a church construction project.As a native speaker of Samoan, I immediately noticed some deviations (re: underlined text) from some of the conventions, notably the mixture of the so-called “t” and “k” pronunciations in one comment. Also odd was the use of the “k” method in an official printed document as in the words “uka” (vs. “uta”) and “faikala” (vs. “faitala”.) I was curious as to whether the deviations had already become standard in Samoa, both in the vernacular and the printed word. So I commented, and the rest of following dialogue ensued.
“I couldn’t control the vehicle. The load was just too heavy.”
“Ua ou fiu le mea e taofi le taavale. Ua mamafa kele lava le uka.”
The officers ... encouraged passing vehicles to move along, as many had slowed down, wanting a closer look (faikala) at the accident site.
LV Letalu
“Ua ou fiu le mea e taofi le taavale. Ua mamafa kele lava le uka.”
To a native speaker, this is funny – and awkward – Samoan speech/talk having to do with the so-called “t” and “k” pronunciations used in the same comment. It can be used as a classic example of such elements in the study of the Samoan language. I wonder if it’s reported or original speech, hence it’s reporter vs. speaker as who the real non-native speaker is. I also notice that the reporter prefers the “k” pronunciation in the two translations “uka simā” vs. “uta simā” and “faikala” vs. “faitala”. The lesson to be learned from this is the role of the media (newspapers, internet, radio, etc.) as the so-called standardizing agents for language. In other words, the more this mixed semantics is used, the more it gets normalized and standardized. Faafekai Tele! ????
Editor
Talofa Mr Letalu. The quotes you refer to are direct ones, ie it’s being cited exactly as the speaker said it to our reporter. Many of us ‘native Samoan speakers’ here in Samoa, use BOTH the ‘t’ and the ‘k’ pronounciation [sic] – often in the same sentence, and we can fluctuate between the two. (Especially in stressful moments.) We don’t correct direct quotes when we use them and prefer to have people sound/speak exactly as they are. We also don’t see a problem with our Samoan speakers using the ‘t’ and/or the ‘k’.
Faafetai tele,
Editor
Samoa Planet
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LV Letalu
Talofa fo’i Editor:
Editor: Talofa Mr Letalu, The quotes you refer to are direct ones, ie it’s being cited exactly as the speaker said it to our reporter
Letalu: Thanks for the clarification on that part of my inquiry.
Editor: Many of us ‘native Samoan speakers’ here in Samoa, use BOTH the ‘t’ and the ‘k’ pronounciation [sic] – often in the same sentence, and we can fluctuate between the two.
Letalu: First of all, it’s not standard, hence not proper, to use both the “t” and “k” pronunciations especially in the same sentence, as claimed. The only time it’s considered proper to use the two together is when the “t” pronunciation is the main reference and you have “k” words which are loan/borrowed words such as “kālone” (gallon) “kopi” (copy) “kālena” (calendar) “kamupani” (company), etc. etc. E.g. Proper: “Na sau le tama e avatu le kālone a le kamupani.” Improper: “Na sau le kama e avatu le taloge a le kamupani.”
The improper version is an example of your “mixed” claim and a true native speaker would point that out, at least in the written/printed form, versus the vernacular. No offense intended, but this non-standard speech can often be found among the little children, and among those who are not well-versed in the Samoan language. Moreover, the mixed “t” and “k”, as you stated, is not taught in a formal classroom setting where Samoan is taught as a structured academic course. I’m glad however that you used quotes in your ‘native Samoan speakers’ designation, which can therefore be interpreted as an anomaly among true native speakers. That said, I understand that language is a social phenomenon and therefore it gradually changes and evolves. Notwithstanding its evolving aspect, a language still has basic consistent rules (syntax, semantics, morphology, grammar, etc.) at any given time and place.
Editor:
We also don’t see a problem with our Samoan speakers using the ‘t’ and/or the ‘k’.
Letalu:Yes, as long as the usage is intuitive and consistent with the established “rules”.
One last example: You wrote “Faafetai tele” which I’m sure was the more intuitive form as opposed to my “Faafekai Tele” which was given in jest and for the purpose of illustrating the point at issue.
Thanks for the dialogue.
Respectfully,
LV Letalu
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News Source/Editor
Talofa again Mr Letalu,
We appreciate your time and expertise shared here. While we are not academic language specialists like yourself, we can assure you of the following:
1. You are correct that the mixed ‘t’ and ‘k’ would not be taught in a formal classroom setting where Samoan is a structured academic course. Its obvious that is where you learned your Samoan and that is the pillar upon which your critique is founded. We salute your extensive knowledge and learning.
2. Sadly, Mr Maiava did not learn his Samoan in a structured academic course. His Samoan was learnt at the feet of his parents, aiga, village and lotu. Samoan is his first language. He was born here, grew up here and speaks Samoan every day, 7 days a week. Does that make him a ‘true native speaker’ of the language? Or does that make his language usage somewhat less worthy or ‘acceptable’ than a person who learns it and speaks it in a structured academic setting?
Experts such as yourself may not like his mixed vernacular, or his ‘break’ with your ‘consistent rules’, but the reality is, that this is how we are speaking Samoan everyday here in Samoa. Have you listened to a session of Parliament lately? Or the local radio stations? Or to the presentation of a sua at any number of ceremonial occasions being held every week here? Mr Maiava’s speech pattern is not unique. It is standard to ‘t’ and ‘k’ all over the place…
The tragedy is, how can you expect the poor man (or any of us here) to speak Samoan to your standards when we are surrounded every day by mixed use of the ‘t’ and ‘k’?! It’s a shocking decline of TRUE Samoan language standards. Clearly we need saving. Perhaps experts like yourself would consider moving here to teach us how to speak Samoan properly?
In the meantime, we trust you will find it in your heart to be more tolerant and understanding of those of us Samoans who don’t live up to your expert language proficiency standards.
Faafetai lava,
Editor
(Oh, and prefacing an offensive remark with “No offence but…” does not make it any less distasteful. It is indeed offensive and the epitome of arrogance, for anyone to assert that Mr Maiava’s speech patterns are those of a ‘little child’ or someone not versed in Samoan language.)
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LV Letalu
Talofa Editor/News Source!
First let me clear up a few things before I respond point for point to your post. Se’e ane i ou se’etaga se’i o’u liliu atu se’i fai se talanoaga.
Most of the things that I’ve advocated so far, notably the mechanics of the Samoan language (usage, grammar, semantics, etc.) are not things that I woke up last week and started fashioning and constructing on a whim. They are actually conventions specific to the Samoan language and have been for years. Linguists, newspapers/sources, schools, government, etc. espouse and adhere to them. They constitute the standards of the language.
The “t” and ‘k” pronunciations (and we have not even touched the “n” and “g” ones, respectively) are two distinct and often discrete manner of speaking and/or writing in Samoan. Strictly speaking (pun intended), the “t” pronunciation is often called “tautala lelei” (good/proper or formal speech). Apparently it is considered “lelei”(good), because it was introduced by the missionaries and churches along with the written alphabet. This “t” style/method is often used in formal settings (churches, schools, government, etc.) as well as the official written/printed convention. That’s why I was somewhat surprised to see “uka” (vs. “uta”) and “faikala” (vs. “faitala”) in the article.
The “k” style, on the other hand, is considered informal (not leaga (bad), per se, as it’s often labeled in opposition to the “good” “t” style). The “k” style – with the exception of loan/borrowed words (re: previous post) comprises the vernacular or everyday parlance. It is also the bona fide style for the chiefs in their traditional roles as faila̅uga (orators) and taulele’a (non-titleholders) in their respective roles during the ‘ava ceremony and sua (food gifts) announcements.
Therefore, when one attends church listening to a pastor’s sermon, and then immediately goes to a chiefs/orators’ meeting, he will notice the stark contrast and difference between the “t” and “k” (and “n” and “g”) pronunciations. This scenario represents the “mix” of the two in an acceptable sense and that can be found in the everyday lives of the people. And that is considered standard and normal. In the next levels below that (i.e. within a section, paragraph, sentence and word), the “mix” gets smeared and becomes non-standard. It starts to sound awkward and superficial.
In the examples below, notice how usage and overall integrity of the language diminish, especially in the mind and perspective of a native speaker, thus refuting your claim of the normalcy in the indiscriminate and haphazard use of the “t” and “k” pronunciations.
a. Paragraph (within): “Ua ou fiu le mea e taofi le taavale. Ua mamafa kele lava le uka.” (I tried my best to stop the car. The load was quite heavy.)
This is from the article. Let me say that if the speaker were a native one, he/she would have said all in the “k” style/vernacular like this:
“Ua ou fiu le mea e kaofi le ka’avale. Ua mamafa kele lava le uka.”
Now a truer native speaker (like me, ha!) would have said:
“Sole, ua ou fiu leaga e kaofi le kaavale, o le [ma]kuā mamafa lava o le uka.”
b. Sentence: “Sa tamo’e le kama e tau mai kipolo.” (The boy ran to pick lemons) Notice the mix in “tamo’e” “kama” “tau” “kipolo” which in the standard styles should either be all “t” or all “k” – not a mix.
c. Word: “Se ku’u le taukala so’o ae sau katou o e tokō tiapula.” (Hey, stop talking too much but come go with us to plant the taro shoots.)
Notice how awkward it sounds when the mix is within the individual words. “taukala” which should be “tautala” or “kaukala” and “katou” which should be “tatou” or “kakou”.
Again the exceptions can be found in loan words, at least in the “t” or the formal/written style. E.g. “ti'ākono” for deacon is standard while “ki'ākogo” is acceptable in the “k” style/method.
Other borrowed/loan words in the same pattern include “tekonolosi” (technology) “kitara”(guitar) “komepiuta”(computer).
Read some of the government documents (Samoan) on your website like speeches by the PM and you will find that there aren’t any “mixes” such as those above.
Editor:
We appreciate your time and expertise shared here. While we are not academic language specialists like yourself, we can assure you of the following:
Letalu:
First of all, I am not an “academic language specialist” or a linguist for that matter. In fact you don’t have to be either to know and understand most of the things we are discussing about the Samoan language. As a native speaker of Samoan, o le tele o lo’u mālamalama e uiga i le gagana, na maua ma tapu’e i lo’u ōlaga i totonu lava o lo’u nu’u ma lo’u āiga i Samoa.
Or, if you prefer the “k” and “g” styles, o le kele o lo’u mālamalama e uiga i le gagaga, ga maua ma kapu’e i lo’u ōlaga i kokogu lava o lo’u gu’u ma lo’u āiga i Samoa.
Editor:
You are correct that the mixed ‘t’ and ‘k’ would not be taught in a formal classroom setting where Samoan is a structured academic course. Its obvious that is where you learned your Samoan and that is the pillar upon which your critique is founded. We salute your extensive knowledge and learning.
Letalu:
While you sarcastically and derisively salute my “extensive knowledge and learning,” you simultaneously malign the academia in its role in the study of languages. Let me remind you, since you’re openly ignorant of the fact that you are, if I may use the maxim, biting the hand that fed/feeds you. Being a Samoan (as in ethnicity) editor for a predominantly English website, you’d have to have taken some academic courses – at least in the language arts – to qualify for the position of an editor. Therefore, for you – again as an editor – to mockingly insult the “formal/structured classroom/academic setting” as the “pillar upon which my critique is founded” is feigned at best and hypocritical at worst. If you continue to advocate such viewpoint, then you may want to start protesting the NUS, and other institutions of higher learning in NZ and advising them about their shenanigans, and vain futile efforts of including the study of the Samoan language in their curricula.
By the way, today, we use the western (pa̅lagi) academia methods and approach in the analysis and study of languages. Vēape (verb), nauna (noun) soā nauna (pronoun), etc., are English concepts. And so to fully understand the mechanics, functions and relationships of the Samoan language we use the pālagi rules and methodologies.
Editor:
Sadly, Mr Maiava did not learn his Samoan in a structured academic course. His Samoan was learnt at the feet of his parents, aiga, village and lotu. Samoan is his first language. He was born here, grew up here and speaks Samoan every day, 7 days a week. Does that make him a ‘true native speaker’ of the language? Or does that make his language usage somewhat less worthy or ‘acceptable’ than a person who learns it and speaks it in a structured academic setting?
Letalu:
That, I must say, is a very poorly constructed thought and logic. It’s anemic, to say the least.
FACT: Being born in Samoa, learning Samoan at the feet of parents, āiga, village, lotu, etc., etc., etc., DO NOT necessarily make one a “true native speaker.” Why? Because it all depends on the “type” of Samoan that is being taught and transmitted.
Case in point: When I was growing up, and went to school at Leifiifi Intermediate (way back then ..lol) and then to Samoa College, there were a lot of kids/students, especially of the half-caste upbringing, who spoke mostly English and little, if any, Samoan. Some of my own cousins who were born and raised in Apia demonstrated the same trend. Most, if not all, of these students had parents, āiga, neighbors who spoke very little Samoan. They even attended churches which used primarily English. In fact I can name a lot of afakasi (halfcaste) families in town whose children fit all your above qualifications and still in the end fall short of being true native speakers, because Samoan was not their first language; English, or pidgin was. And yet they were born, raised and lived in Samoa all their lives.
Moreover, this is not limited to only the children, there are adults who have acquired the Samoan language handicap since their childhood years because of their limited exposure to the language or their reluctance to learn or speak it. I can guarantee you that not much has changed in the above example, even today. Maybe you will thank this exchange and debate that you have learned something about some important social principles and fundamentals.
Editor:
Experts such as yourself may not like his mixed vernacular, or his ‘break’ with your ‘consistent rules’, but the reality is, that this is how we are speaking Samoan everyday here in Samoa. Have you listened to a session of Parliament lately? Or the local radio stations? Or to the presentation of a sua at any number of ceremonial occasions being held every week here? Mr Maiava’s speech pattern is not unique. It is standard to ‘t’ and ‘k’ all over the place…
Letalu:
Have I listened to a session of Parliament? I have listened to the ones of the bygone years and I doubt the changes, if any, are as dramatic as you are trying to make them out to be. But if true, then I would be expecting something like this in a typical session:
“Se e faaku’iese lo’u magatu i le sui lea mai le Itukolu o Sagana ma le Faleogo o Leakinana. O le makaupu e uiga i le lisi o fanua kau Samoa, e matuā le fekaui a ma lo’u manaku…” Hahaaa…
Is that how they “mix it up” now in Parliament? If there is a sui (representative) who speaks like that now, then he/she needs to undergo speech therapy.
And on a local radio station, something like this?
“Ia faakalofa atu i le ‘au faafofona i lenei ikulā o le taeao…”
Or during the folafolaga o le sua (sua announcement), which is by default uses the “k” style. Then maybe something like this is kosher (pun intended)?
“Fāliu ia alo o le lupe a’o se silafaga maualuga i lau tofā a le Kuiatua Faanofogofo, se maimoa i le Falefia o Alii Amituaga’i ma i la’ua Suafa, taigage le mamalu i ko’oko’o (or ko’oto’o) …” Huh?
So, such a mixed speech pattern is not unique? And that represents the norm now? Because that’s exactly what you mean by mixed vernacular being standard “all over the place”. What you’re suggesting is there are no more set patterns for Samoan speech, in the vernacular, at least. If that’s the case, then I am not surprised at some major efforts – in Samoa and NZ – to teach, revive and revitalize the Samoan language in a “structured academic setting.” Moreover, you’re implying that I have been away for too long from Samoa, hence my seeming disconnect. Honestly, there is no disconnect.
Editor:
The tragedy is, how can you expect the poor man (or any of us here) to speak Samoan to your standards when we are surrounded every day by mixed use of the ‘t’ and ‘k’?! It’s a shocking decline of TRUE Samoan language standards. Clearly we need saving. Perhaps experts like yourself would consider moving here to teach us how to speak Samoan properly?
Letalu:
Do I detect a capitulation or a surrender of some sort in your comments? They (comments) are certainly not tongue-in-cheek, are they? Based on the assumption that what you said (excepting the last sarcastic sentence) is serious, then I’m interpreting your declaration that the mixed use of the “t” and “k” styles as a “shocking decline of TRUE Samoan language standards….[and] we need saving,” to be genuine. If so, then you and I agree that the “t” and “k” mix is actually an aberration, a deviation from the standard, as I said, and not the norm as you have argued.
Editor:
In the meantime, we trust you will find it in your heart to be more tolerant and understanding of those of us Samoans who don’t live up to your expert language proficiency standards.
Letalu:
I was not intolerant, instead I was just pointing out an anomaly, to which you have obviously agreed, and therefore to my “expert language proficiency standards.”
Editor:
(Oh, and prefacing an offensive remark with “No offence but…” does not make it any less distasteful. It is indeed offensive and the epitome of arrogance, for anyone to assert that Mr Maiava’s speech patterns are those of a ‘little child’ or someone not versed in Samoan language.)
Letalu:
I hope you, Editor, will be honest in disclosing where you were born and raised – kuā vs. Apia. I was born, raised and lived in one of the most rural villages you can find and little children’s speech in these areas consist of a “mix” (of the “t” and “k”) and everything else. It is very unintelligible. Again if you were not born, raised and lived in a rural village then you have missed what I was/am saying. And that’s why I had to insert a pardon as preface, because I know it can be offensive IF not interpreted correctly and IF the facts are not known or understood. Ae faamalie atu i le susuga ia Maiava (talu ai o lena e te sui momo’e Editor) pe afai ua le tau tamāli’i se upu, ia mālū̄ fo’i ‘ave i fale i le finagalo, ae o la lava na sa’olele le tuuina atu o se manatu.
That’s it for now, aye?
Faafetai,
LV Letalu
